God is Not My Co-Pilot!

Or My Partner...

Published on August 2, 2004 By Shulamite In Philosophy

"God is my co-pilot" reads the bumpersticker. This implies God is in control with you. He's in the passenger seat next to you, holding the map, making suggestions. Rather ludicrous, don't you think?

Our society has seen God "tamed." We want all of the God-niceties, none of the bad. A saccharine God-substitue. Santa Claus, not King; Protector, not Judge. I think this goes a long way to explain our society's fascination with angels -- they're a sort of tame god in a way, right? All fluffy and nice and protecting and loving but unable to judge. Maybe it also explains an undue reliance on human beings who are in heaven to answer our prayers some how. We desperately want a tame God.

Is it okay to say "I just want God to be my partner, not my boss, not my king,"? I think appropriate here is the expression, "like hell it is."

You see, we know we love God if we obey Him. Check it out for yourself. The book of 1 John is a short read and it will go into detail for you on this point. We HAVE to obey Him. Does that sound like a partnership to you? Not to me. In fact, as I've stated before, there is no room in the Christian vocabulary for the phrase, "No, Lord." It's an oxymoron. Think about it.

You ask, "Do I have to love Him then?" A swift look at the ten commandments says you do! It's in Deuteronomy, too. "What more have I required of you?" asks God. Jesus says the law can be boiled down to loving God and loving your neighbor as yourself. Seems pretty darn important to God to put it first.

Thus: We know we have to love Him. We know we have to obey Him to love Him. We know we cannot obey Him and follow what WE want to do all the time. We have to be submissive and do what he wants. Therefore, God (Father, Son, Holy Spirit) is and must be our King, not our co-pilot or partner or any other watered-down nonsense you want to throw out there.

God abhors lukewarm Christianity that wants fluff and no matter. The scriptures say it makes Him vomit (Revelation won't take you that long to finish either. Check it out). Sounds pretty passionate about it, don't you think? It's like mocking him. Setting up a little straw-god to hang from your rear-view mirror. Rub it's noggin in times of trouble, kiss it for luck, tuck it under your pillow for sweet dreams. Don't take it too seriously. Don't, by any means, let it change your life. God says repeatedly that He will not be mocked. If you're making Him into a Santa Claus or a vending machine or a get-out-of-jail-free card while calling him God, you need to re-evaluate your faith and whether it fits with what you claim to believe.

If I seem to have taken a hard edge on this, I hope you'll show me where it can be softened and still be truthful. "

Comments (Page 1)

web_poet

on Aug 02, 2004

To be confiding in god about our most intimate ambitions is okay,as long as they re things good for society.

But to ask god to be a partner for some selfish motives,thats bad.

It all depends on what ends you seek.

Shulamite

on Aug 02, 2004

I think perhaps we miscommunicated, your poetship. I'm talking about partnership vs. Lordship.

MarcieMoo

on Aug 02, 2004

The new testament is also adamant about loving God....I don't remember which Gospel...but it's called "The Great Commandment"...it's basically what was said in Deuteronomy: Love the Lord your God will all your heart, soul, mind, and strength"....

Shulamite

on Aug 05, 2004

You're right Marcie! In fact, I think you're so right, I even included it my article! Take another gander:

You ask, "Do I have to love Him then?" A swift look at the ten commandments says you do! It's in Deuteronomy, too. "What more have I required of you?" asks God. Jesus says the law can be boiled down to loving God and loving your neighbor as yourself. Seems pretty darn important to God to put it first.

I know, it's easy to miss when skimming, but hey, we're all guilty of it. The whole book of 1 John, as I mention in another article is about God's love and loving God.

Anyone read this substantively????

Lord Shitzu

on Aug 06, 2004

Anyone read this substantively????

I did, and I don't agree with any of it, but then again I'm not the type that would, so please don't be offended.

On that note, I can't understand how Christians can live their lives like that, believing themselves to be at the mercy of what is clearly a moody tyrant and yet striving to "love" said tyrant. If God were real, and he were to prove this to me, and demand I bow down before him, I would absolutely not do it, because I can't stand inflated ego, no matter who the owner.

Christians who believe in a loving and forgiving God are people I can understand, if not agree with, but those who preach fire and brimstone and then order you to bend over and take it from God because he's God and that's all there is to it, are an enigma to me.

It's really just an extension of unreasonable "respect thy parents" philosophy. God is your "maker" so you should respect and obey him, but would you obey your parents regardless their demands? If your father was a sick man and sexually abused you, would you love him all the more for it because he's your father, your maker, and he can do no wrong? I don't understand that sort of view at all.

Pearlcaster

on Aug 07, 2004

If God were real, and he were to prove this to me, and demand I bow down before him, I would absolutely not do it, because I can't stand inflated ego, no matter who the owner

Tell me, Shitzu, how a being capable of producing the known universe can have an 'inflated ego'? And if, supposing a being so ineffable were to take notice of your ridiculous self-satisfaction, God were to appear before you in all its power (the same power that created the universe mind you) do you sincerely believe you are capable of standing before it and telling it to go fuck itself?

Ohhhhh you're gonna be soooooooooooo fucked.

Explain, please, how one 'owns' an ego. Did you buy yours, and if so what did you pay for it? Did you get a discount for purchasing the bloated, grotesque model you currently possess? Were coupons accepted as part of the exchange? Do you get an owner's loyalty bonus when you trade it in for the new model? Does it have go-faster stripes? Alloy wheels?

Myself, I believe in a God both cruel and humorous, and I'm gonna enjoy watching it make you bend over and take it - after watching you tell it to go fuck itself, of course.

~~DivasRule~~

Pearlcaster

on Aug 07, 2004

I think this goes a long way to explain our society's fascination with angels -- they're a sort of tame god in a way, right? All fluffy and nice and protecting and loving but unable to judge.

If you knew your Bible half as well as you think you do you'd know that the attitude of Angels to humanity is not one of 'Awwww. How sweet... Let's look after these poor humans' but one of envious lust, with a liberal sprinkling of hate. It was Angelic lust for the daughters of men that first drew them into intercourse (pun intended) with human beings, not love. And their envy and hate is due to the fact that humanity has been placed in authority over them, not in virtue of our possessing attributes and powers greater than their own but simply by the decree of God.

And as for their being 'fluffy and nice' I suggest you re-read those passages of the OT dealing with the reactions of those who entered into direct communication with them. So far as I'm aware, when Ezekiel returned to himself after his visions by the banks of the Kebar river, his first reaction was not to say 'goddamn them's some nice n fluffy angels out there', but to sit in stunned silence for seven days.

God abhors lukewarm Christianity that wants fluff and no matter.

So far as I can see, God abhors a lot of things. And while I might be wrong, I imagine that fairly high up on the list of things that piss God off might be an item that reads something like this - 'people who mock the first-born children of my creation and, by extension, mock me'.

As I meditated my way to sleep last night a small voice gave me some good advice. Since I doubt very much that you'll understand it I'm happy to share it with you. It goes like this:-

"Do not, in the folly of human pride, give utterance to those thoughts which may cause those who are far older, far wiser and infinitely more powerful than you, to take notice of you where before they had passed over your ignorance in silence." Who knows? You too might receive a visitation that reduces you to a 7-days stupefaction. Or perhaps the Angel who passed over Egypt might just drop a feather in your bed.

~~DivasRule~~

Sir Peter Maxwell

on Aug 07, 2004

God allows me to do as I wish because I was born with noble blood, my admittance to heaven is pre-ordained.

Gideon MacLeish

on Aug 07, 2004

Good post, shulamite, excellent responses all.

We're going to disagree on the nature and existence of God until one day we find out there's a lot of limitation to all we know. I marvel when I think of the passage that speaks of God knowing all of the stars by name (there are something like 10 to the 25th power stars in the universe; that's 100,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000, for those keeping score at home), it speaks to me of a language that's so complex, so thorough that it can't even be conceived by our limited imaginations. I believe that much of the nature of God is like this. To draw Him into a box, ANY box, in terms expressed in our limited knowledge and understanding, is to demean Him and create Him in our own image. There is a whole lot that we cannot and will not know in this existence).

Pearlcaster

on Aug 08, 2004

To draw Him into a box, ANY box, in terms expressed in our limited knowledge and understanding, is to demean Him and create Him in our own image.

That's a very good point. But by referring to it (deity) as Him, you've already put it in a box.

The human mind understands God only analogically and metaphorically. The created cannot conceive of its creator in any way other than analogically and metaphorically, since the creator is always in excess of, and other than, the created. Every faith is a box, including mine. It's just that some boxes are better built than others.

~~DivasRule~~

Shulamite

on Aug 09, 2004

Shitzu -- I'm glad you read the article and trust me, I'm not offended at all by your opinion. You stated your disagreement well and cordially I think. I don't think Christians demand you bow before our God as much as we believe you will have to one day. God is Love (1 John 4:8) but because He is love, He cannot tolerate injustice infinitely. Otherwise, he'd be unjust, right? And you say "respect your parents" but then say "obey" later. I don't think they're the same thing. I can respect someone and not obey them. Like my brother. I respect him greatly but I may not always take his advice, you know? Or a friend. Or a financial advisor. But I should not be rude or disrespectful. Christianity calls all believers to treat others the way they would want to be treated. I don't think the response you've hitherto received here has done that for you and for that I apologize. And I think God's not exactly a moody tyrant; he has rules and promises and obeys and keeps them. He's rather predictable when it comes to those things. The way he does things is sometimes unexpected, though, because (I think) we have limited originality at times. I hope you'll post here again in the future. You're always welcome.

Pearl -- Wow, mighty explosive comments. Explosive isn't always bad. Let me take a look at your response to my article from the outside first and then from the inside, okay? First, I notice you don't bring up any qualms or disagreements with the premise of my article: That God is King and not partner. Instead, you've chosen a much smaller point within it, namely that I theorize our society prefers a tame god and I think this explains why our society is so fascinated with angels. Then I notice that you take not only my argument but me too and make an amalgamated straw-man (or -person if you prefer) with which to argue. The straw-man looks like this: "I think Angels are fluffy and cute and I'm ignorant and prideful." Now that's a rather easy straw-man to attack! You successfully attack this straw-man by bringing up Ezekiel, giving him a hick accent -- traditionally associated with ignorance -- to illustrate the sarcasm you're trying to use to bolster your point. I'm not sure why you bring up Angels lusting after women -- I'd have to see a scriptural reference for that (Satan fell because of pride long before the Earth was created). You also contend that angels have hatred for mankind, envy even. I need scripture for that too, because other than fallen angels, I don't think that can be said of angels in general.

To look at that comment from the inside: If you'll re-read my statement, you'll clearly see my point is thus: SOCIETY looks for a tame god in angels. I'm not suggesting angels are in any way tame. I'm saying society tries to reduce them to such. Biblical cherubs are not fat babies; they have many eyes, many wings, four faces, burning coals, and wheels for flying... what I was saying is that society makes angels "fluffy" and "cute" so that they can have a tame god preferable to a God that will judge them. Think of the fad and it will all make sense. If you snuck up on a victorian angel, you'd startle her -- never mind the only three angels named in the Bible all have male names. Society thinks angels are only there to guard and protect -- but the very word angel means "messenger" and they more often than not brought devestation and death. I think one angel killed some 187,000 wasn't it? Anyway, my point still stands that society makes tame gods. Sorry if you misread it and wasted your time.

Also, as for making me a part of your straw-man argument, I'm not the ignorant thing you'd like to believe. I'll be the first to admit my pride is atrocious quite often and I can be down-right ashamed of it. That's why I go to great pains in my articles to not offend anyone -- but never by watering down the truth. I just don't take joy in offending people and try to treat others the way I want to be treated. However I do notice something about your replies: You take great pride in what you believe you know and almost seem to think well of yourself for what you know. You seemed to take great joy in "teaching a thing or two" to Shitzu and me. I'm sure you were very angry at the pride you detected in my article and in his comment. I've noticed those with the most pride tolerate it least in others and notice it least in themselves. And it was this that caused Satan to fall; not lust for women. Pride is the center of all sin and the only one that is directly competitive. If you don't believe me, look at your final line to me: "Do not, in the folly of human pride, give utterance to those thoughts which may cause those who are far older, far wiser and infinitely more powerful than you, to take notice of you where before they had passed over your ignorance in silence." You're telling me to keep my mouth shut because I'm prideful and people who are older, wiser, and more powerful are going to notice and do things to me whereas before they might not have. I assume you're talking about yourself -- though you'll probably deny this now. What I am pointing to is the "older, wiser, more powerful" part. Pride is not concerned with age, wisdom, power, money, generosity, or anything in and of itself. It's only concerned with having MORE than what others have. Seemed like your primary concern; that's all.

I'm not sure if the feather comment was supposed to be offensive but you don't seem to care much about offending others so I'll take it as such. I'm sorry about that.

It's been an interesting conversation, Pearl. Also, how is saying "Him" putting God in a Box when Jesus Christ Himself called Him "Father?"

Shulamite

on Aug 09, 2004

Sir Peter : We're all princesses and princes when our Father is the King...
Little Whip -- I'm gonna think that's not directed at me.

Gideon -- this is such a great post. I liked the part about creating God in our own image. I think that' s what we do when we try to make him our "partner" rather than our King. He reveals himself to us in a loving relationship but he has to be in charge -- religion doesn't substitue for that. Your posts and articles are always amazing. Thanks for the uplifting comment.

Gideon MacLeish

on Aug 09, 2004

Every faith is a box, including mine. It's just that some boxes are better built than others.

Very insightful statement, pearl.

Lord Shitzu

on Aug 09, 2004

Tell me, Shitzu, how a being capable of producing the known universe can have an 'inflated ego'?

I think humility is a virtue, I'm sure a god has no NEED to be humble, and that's all the more reason why he should be, that's just how I think *Shrug*.

And if, supposing a being so ineffable were to take notice of your ridiculous self-satisfaction, God were to appear before you in all its power (the same power that created the universe mind you) do you sincerely believe you are capable of standing before it and telling it to go fuck itself?

I suppose maybe I wouldn't, but then again I can't answer before that were to happen without bias, since as of right now I don't believe in Him, Her, or It. Therefore, the idea of It creating the universe makes no impression on me, since to my mind, It didn't, and I can't appreciate any other effect It's presence could have on me, since I don't see It even existing.

Explain, please, how one 'owns' an ego. Did you buy yours, and if so what did you pay for it? Did you get a discount for purchasing the bloated, grotesque model you currently possess? Were coupons accepted as part of the exchange? Do you get an owner's loyalty bonus when you trade it in for the new model? Does it have go-faster stripes? Alloy wheels?

I got it on eBay, and it was't quite as advertised. Still, it serves me for the time being. And I left negative feedback.

I love your writing style Pearl, if not necessarily the way you use it sometimes.

Shulamite:

And you say "respect your parents" but then say "obey" later.

Indeed, I was basically trying to contrast the two, going back to my words about humility above: I could appreciate mutual respect, but not blind obedience. And as you say "God as King" I say respect the King, but if he fails to respect you, and looks down upon the people, get the guillotine. And that's the feel I get from some old Bible stories.

And thank you for the kind words, I haven't been treated too badly around here, and I intend to stick around for a while >8).

Pearlcaster

on Aug 10, 2004

To Shulamite:

I was at one time an orthodox (by which I mean 'right-thinking', not a member of one of the Eastern branches of Christianity) born-again, happy-clappy, fire-breathing fundamentalist of the worst and most egregious sort. If I am now a Christian at all, I am a Christian heretic.

You're telling me to keep my mouth shut because I'm prideful and people who are older, wiser, and more powerful are going to notice and do things to me whereas before they might not have. I assume you're talking about yourself

Certainly not. I was telling you to be either silent (or become more knowlegeable - in which case you would be silent anyway) because the term 'Angel' designates a being that is real, deadly, and not to be spoken of lightly.

I'm not sure why you bring up Angels lusting after women -- I'd have to see a scriptural reference for that

Genesis 6: 1-2. Then go read the amplified version in the Book of Henoch (or Enoch), book 1, chaps 1-36.

You also contend that angels have hatred for mankind, envy even. I need scripture for that too, because other than fallen angels, I don't think that can be said of angels in general.

If your definition of scripture is restricted to the Biblical canon then I can't oblige you. If it encompasses other texts I refer you once more to the Book of Henoch (which is the most comprehensive of the ancient texts). Other than that I can say only that the Angels who fell (that in Christian eschatology are referred to as 'demons') did so because of their will to power expressed through the transgression of intercourse with human women (transgression because they so far strayed from their own nature as to leave the spiritual for the carnal in act of wilfull rebellion).

However I do notice something about your replies: You take great pride in what you believe you know and almost seem to think well of yourself for what you know. You seemed to take great joy in "teaching a thing or two" to Shitzu and me.

Pride is no longer, for me, the great head of sin it is to Christians. Certainly I take pride in the progress I have made. After decades of confusion and spiritual misery I begin to shed, one by one, the shackles of guilt, fear, and that false humility which is also pride, in which I was bound as a consequence of my faith in the Christian creed. You're damn right I take pride in what I have achieved as it's only my own will to find a truth that will satisfy me that has kept me sane all these years.

And yes, I realise that the phrase 'only my own will' exposes me to attack on general Christian grounds. But as pride is no longer a head of sin for me, neither is will. They are faults in terms of Christian thinking, yes. But as I said above, I barely count myself as a Christian anymore.

You appear to be sincere. I offered you a warning in a spirit of friendliness. You'd do well to heed it. God has placed man above the Angels (since they have places in both spiritual and physical worlds, whereas Angels rightfully occupy only one) so that man has authority over them. But in order to exercise that authority one must first have faith in it, and then express it through conscious will. Even when one has achieved these things, it's necessary to express the will in a form the Angels acknowledge - and it must always be remembered that it is not the name of man that is given such authority, but the name of God (the imago dei) in man through which such authority speaks. When one commands an Angel it is not the voice of man that is heard, but the voice of God in man, who for his own reasons grants such grace.

I was once as you appear to be now. Then a door was opened to me, and I walked through it. Speaking from the other side of that door, I say to you that you should be careful in your choice of thoughts to give utterance to. Because God is not mocked, and neither are his Angels.

~~DivasRule~~

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